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<title level="m">Miriam Grossman Shoah Foundation Testimony</title>
<date when="1995-11-21">November 21, 1995</date>
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<sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>November 21, 1995. Survivor, 
Miriam Grossman. Interviewer,  


Ben Nachman. Omaha, Nebraska. Language, English.


My name is Ben Nachman, interviewing Miriam  Grossman. Omaha, Nebraska. November 21, 1995.


Can you give me your name, please? 
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> My name is Miriam Grossman.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And how do you spell your last name? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> G-R-O-S-S-M-A-N.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And where--  


where were you born? Where were you born?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I was born in a city by the name Konin. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And where was this?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It was May the 8th, 1916. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>In what country?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> In Poland. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>In Poland. Did you come from a large family? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, very large family.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Can you describe your family for me? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> My immediate family? I had-- I am one of 
nine children. Should I give you the names?  


The eldest is Braunia, then Moisha [? Wolf, 
?] a-- a brother. And then Gita, or Guta,  


a sister. And then Miriam, I. And Yetka, or 
Yenta, another sister. And then brothers again,  


Gershon Zelig, Gecel, Yisrael, and Leibish.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And where did you fit in with  


the children, in what order?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Almost in the middle. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was your father born in the same town?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, my father was born in Grabow,  


I think, a small town.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you know how to  


spell that name?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> G-R-A-B-O-W. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And where was your mother born?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't know. But I think in Konin. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>In Konin.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I think. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was your family a religious family?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>You attended synagogue regularly?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, they were religious. They were  


traditional. We observed the-- 
the traditional Jewish things. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>In the home?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> In the home. And my  


father was a-- a-- a religious man, and a 
very wise man. He studied. All the time,  


he studied. But he wasn't well. So my mother help 
him out in the store, so he will not overdo, and  


be able to take care of the children's behavior.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>What kind of a store did he have? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> We had a double store. My bubbe had a half, 
and we had a half. She had materials, and we had  


glassware, silverware, pottery, things like that.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How was your family  


economically during this time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Middle-class people. We were very  


careful. We couldn't afford many thing, but it was 
no tragedy. We-- we were a middle-class people. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did the family all help in the store?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Not the whole family. The-- the boys were  


educated in Jewishness. And two, two or three of 
the children were helping in the store. And the  


others went in school, and so on, and so on.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you go to school? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, there was a gymnasium, and-- but 
it was just the beginning of my education. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long did you attend this school?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't remember. But not enough. I  


didn't finish it.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>You didn't? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> There is no question.
INT:  


How long did you live in Konin?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> My god, I just don't remember.  


Dates don't cling in my mind.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you move from Konin? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> From Konin, we moved to Lodz, to a big city.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And how do you spell that name? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> L-O-D-Z.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you lived  


there. Where you're growing up in Lodz?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, we were growing up there. We were  


working there, helping out our parents. 
And we had some relatives there, too. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did your father still have a store in Lodz?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. No, we had to help to support the family. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did your father continue 
his Jewish studies at that time? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, he didn't give up. He had 
to work too, the things he could  


do at home. But he did not give up studies.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you attend synagogue regularly in Lodz? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I did not regularly go to synagogue, 
but for the holidays, my father was. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you remember the years you lived in Lodz?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, it's hard for me to get out the years.  


Numbers, years is hard for me.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was your livelihood as  


good in Lodz as it had been in Konin?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I can't make a comparison. It was different. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were any of your brothers 
and sisters married at this time? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> At which time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>When you lived in Lodz. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, they married in Lodz. They married-- my 
older sister and the other sister and a-- and a  


brother, and another brother, eventually married.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did they have children? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. One of my brothers lived a little 
further from Lodz, and he had one child when  


the-- when the war broke out.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you remember the  


name of the city he lived in?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, I tried to remember, and it just  


didn't come to me. It was close to Lodz.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>During this time,  


was Lodz a-- a very Jewish city?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] a very  


Jewish city, and a-- [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] 
a city where you could work or have a store,  


make a living, and develop, and many opportunities 
for people who could afford. It was a big city. It  


was the second largest city in Poland.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How large a city was it? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> [LAUGHS] I don't know. I can't tell you.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was the Jewish percentage very large? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, mostly.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>The city was mostly Jewish? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Mostly, to my understanding.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did the Jewish people tend  


to live in a specific area?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Well, this is natural, yes,  


but not like in a ghetto. Because 
there were so many Jews, that they  


had to live everywhere. But some groups were 
concentrated, and some of them were dispersed. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>During this period, were 
you active in any organizations? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. We just were kind of brought up properly 
at home, and we helped to work a little bit,  


to help our parents. And we had some relatives. 
So it was a comfortable life. For my parents,  


of course, it wasn't so easy. But 
for the children, we didn't complain. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Can you describe your home for me?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Oh, my dear. There was a hall and a kitchen,  


and a-- a big room, and a smaller room, 
and a-- a restroom, and a big, great,  


[PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] how to say? When you 
go out from a house, you have a-- a veranda,  


something like that. It was a comfortable home.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was it a-- was it an-- an individual home,  


rather than an apartment?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It was an apartment,  


but it was a big apartment. It was a-- a-- a whole 
cluster of apartments, and this was one of them,  


on a first-- on a-- a second floor.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did your family own this apartment? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, we just paid rent.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>What occupations were your  


brothers involved with at this time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Well, they were helping Daddy in  


making gloves out of-- out of thread.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did they do this in the home? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> In the home, yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And who did they sell these gloves to? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> They didn't sell it. They had it from a 
factory, and the factory paid them for the work. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>During the late '30s, when did you start 
noticing changes, or did you, in Poland,  


as you approached the war years?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> This was a-- a very sudden  


thing in Poland. It came, like, overnight-- 
a blitzkrieg. [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] There  


were bombs [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] thrown on 
Poland. And it was a-- a very quick overtake  


from as-- of the German-- from the German.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was anyone in your family in the military? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. But after the war, my-- one 
of my brothers went to the military. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>When-- after this blitzkrieg, 
was your city occupied? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Right away.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And occupied by whom? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> By the German, by the Nazis.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you notice any  


difference in the treatment at this time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Of course. We couldn't go out. We were  


afraid. We were taken out from-- from the houses, 
many people. And they did that with a very great  


speed. And they took us right away into a ghetto.
They-- they want to empty the Lodz and put them  


all separate, in a ghetto. And we didn't 
know the reason. But then-- and we found  


out that the reason was to destroy us, eventually, 
because they couldn't just destroy us singularly. 


And they had a-- made wire, you know, the-- 
there were wires around the ghetto so we  


couldn't run away. And we couldn't take 
anything more than we could handle. And  


we left everything. We had to leave everything.
And they just pushed us in wherever there was  


a-- a little opening. And you can imagine 
so many thousand people in a small area, on  


the outskirt of a city. It was just horrible. We 
just didn't know what's going on. We were stupor. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>During this period, did the-- this happen 
gradually, that they put people into the ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> As soon as possible. They were rushing us.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you leave your home to go to this ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> We had to.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>The ghetto was located in  


an area different than your home.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was it distant from you, a long distance?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It was quite a distance. And we-- and we  


couldn't have any transportation. We had to 
walk. And we were just in a stupor. We just  


didn't know what's going on.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you assigned places  


to live in the ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Pardon me? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you assigned 
places to live in the ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, wherever we could find a-- a hole, then 
they-- they-- they just pushed us. Wherever  


there was a-- a-- a place empty, they pushed 
us. And they, in certain times, they-- they  


pushed several families in one-- in one room. It's 
impossible to describe the-- the life in ghetto. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was your family together at this time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. My-- [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] my older  


sister, myself, and my younger sister, 
and two of my brothers. And the others,  


they were either in-- married, you know, 
or in-- lived in a-- in a different hole. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>But the entire family was in the ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Entire family. Not only ours,  


but whatever they could grab.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you able to see the other  


members of your family in this ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Very seldom, because we were afraid  


to even move around.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>What did you do in  


the ghetto? Did you have a job?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I tried to help people in a  


hospital. I was a nurse. I-- I- I was a nurse. 
In Lodz, I began my nursing career. But when--  


when I was in the ghetto, I was working 
in a hospital as a-- as a nurse already.  


And-- and I had my floor of patients. 
And-- and I remember it very pleasantly,  


because I helped a lot of people in the hospital.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were these people that were in the ghetto  


that were in this hospital? People that lived 
in the ghetto, were they in this hospital? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, only, because there was-- Lodz 
was cleaned up of Jews. All the Jews were  


in the ghetto. And because there was such a 
overpopulation, so every day, they took a-- a  


bunch of people, and they told them they are 
gonna take to work. But they took them away,  


and we found out later that they destroyed 
them, to make room. Just-- just so [INAUDIBLE]. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you know where they took these people?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> We didn't know. We were in a-- in circle,  


and we didn't know. But some people said 
that they are taking them to destroy. But  


who wanted to believe that?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you have adequate  


food when you were in the ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, we had rations. We had to stay  


in a row and get the ration. And-- and the-- 
the longer it take, the less food we got. And  


my father and my mother didn't have enough food.
And they were sick. And we couldn't get medication  


for them. And we couldn't get enough food for 
them. And they just, [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] how  


to say? [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] Were 
undernourished and no medication. They  


were sick. And eventually, they died.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>While in the ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>You mentioned that you worked as a nurse. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you being trained  


as a nurse, or had you gone to school to learn?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I was a nurse before the-- the-- before the  


Germans take off-- took off-- took-- 
before the blitzkrieg. I was young,  


but I did like nursing. And-- 
and I started my-- my nursing  


career right before the- the war. But I was very 
able and capable, and I was a-- a-- a nurse in  


the ghetto, and a very reliable one.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you trained to be a nurse,  


or were you learning on the job?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Oh, partially this way, and partially  


that way. We did have a monitor. And-- and we 
have the experience right away, on the job too. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you have classroom work?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't know if you can call it classroom,  


but there was time to-- to [PAUSES 
FOR 3 SECONDS] teach us the methods. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long were you working as a 
nurse before you went into the ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Not too long. Not too long.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Now, during your time in the ghetto, were  


you able to maintain contact with your family?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, I was living with them. We were sleeping  


on the floor on-- on mattresses or-- or straw, 
whatever it is. We had terrible conditions,  


but I was-- we were working 12 hours a 
day, and then 12 hours a night. But we  


were in our places. From there, we went 
to work, and from work, we come home. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Can you give me an idea of what 
a daily food ration was in the ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't remember exactly, but there's the-- 
a-- a-- a portion of bread, and some potato,  


and [PAUSES FOR 4 SECONDS] I don't know. I 
don't remember. I-- I just don't remember,  


but I know it was very scarce, very scarce.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Can you describe the  


ghetto for me at this time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> How can I describe it? It's-- people were  


frustrated. People were-- they didn't know 
what happened. They didn't know what to do.  


It was just a-- a terrible situation.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were children kept with their  


families during this period?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't think that they  


made a-- a-- a special plan 
for it, but some children did,  


and some children didn't.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you have any idea  


how many people were in the ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No, I don't know the numbers,  


but I know that-- that there were so many 
people that they were almost [? growing ?] one  


on the other. But they were relieved every day, 
because every day, they took so many people away,  


and told them that they are taking them to the-- 
to work. But they took them to the-- to destroy. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>While you were in the ghetto, did 
you have some sort of identification? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Not that I recall.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you ever able to walk  


around the ghetto when you weren't working?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> We were afraid, because the Germans,  


soldiers, were walking around and see 
that nobody will smuggle out. So we were  


afraid of them. We did, but very little.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>By doing this, were you able to see  


the rest of your family that were 
located other than where you lived? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Very seldom. We are afraid.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How were the Polish people  


toward you at this time?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> We didn't have any  


contact with them. They were happy, I'm sure, 
because they had a profit. We had to leave  


everything behind, and they had a profit.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>When you left everything behind,  


was your apartment closed off at that 
time? The apartment where you lived, was  


it closed off when you were taken to the ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't know what they did. They just says,  


out of here. And I-- I even want to 
take some pictures from the wall,  


and they didn't let me. Out. They were with 
the bayonets, with the, you know, and speed.  


And they- they did that to-- to confuse us.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>The guards in the ghetto, were they all  


German guards?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Who? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>The guards in the ghetto.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> The guards were-- yeah. There-- there  


was a-- a group of Jewish policemen, but it was 
just like a play. There was the eldest of Juden,  


the one who is over the ghetto. But he 
played more to the Germans than to the Jews,  


because he was afraid of himself, too.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you remember who he was? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I knew. I forgot.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And the Jewish police,  


how were they toward You? How did they treat you?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Well, we didn't get into their-- into their  


way. They just-- I think that they, 
themselves, didn't know what to do.  


They wanted to be lenient, and they had to 
show that they are in charge, and so on. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>You said that your mother and father were 
both undernourished in the ghetto. Can you tell me  


what happened to your mother and father?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> They died. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>In the ghetto?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> In the ghetto. And  


it was so bad. We didn't have it-- we didn't even 
have people to-- to dig the graves and wash the--  


the dead. And I and another lady, we were washing 
my mother. I remember, I was washing my mother,  


taken off a-- a door from-- from the house, 
putting the dead Mama on there, and-- and washing  


her off. It was horrible things.


INT:  November 21, 1985. Interview with survivor Miriam 
Grossman. Mrs. Grossman, you were telling me about  


washing your mother's--
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> 1985? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>1995.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> '95, yeah. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>You were telling me about washing your 
mother's body in preparation for burial. Can  


you tell me more about that story?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Well, there is nothing to tell  


anymore. We had to bury the body. So-- 
and we didn't have people to do that. So  


in many families, people had to do it themselves, 
with a friend or with a neighbor, and-- and then  


bury them many times by themselves.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was there a cemetery? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> There was a cemetery, yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you were able to bury  


your mother and your father in this cemetery?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I think so, yes. There was-- there was a  


bigger cemetery than the ghetto itself.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was that cemetery preserved,  


or was it destroyed?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't know. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long were you in this ghetto, in Lodz? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Oh my God. Again, the dates. [PAUSES FOR 3 
SECONDS] A few years. [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] No,  


not so many. [PAUSES FOR 4 SECONDS] I 
don't remember. [PAUSES FOR 5 SECONDS]  


But a-- a few years-- three or four. [PAUSES 
FOR 5 SECONDS] Three or four. I don't remember. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did conditions get worse as the time went on?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>They did.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> And in the--  


in the hospital where I was working, we didn't 
have enough medication. We didn't have enough  


beds. People were laying on the-- in the hall, and 
so on. It-- it was a-- it was a terrible thing. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Of the members of your family, you said 
that you lost your mother and your father  


in the ghetto. Did you lose any other 
members of your family in the ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I didn't see them die.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>But you do feel that you lost some members? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, because I-- they were taken away.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Who was taken away? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> The Germans.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>No,  


which members of your family were taken away?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Oh, my oldest sister with his-- her husband,  


and my brother with his wife, and several 
children, and another brother. They were-- [PAUSES  


FOR 9 SECONDS] I just can't concentrate anymore.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>This was-- you were still in the ghetto  


when they were taken away?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, but we didn't see it.  


Because when they were in different places, 
we just came over, and they were gone. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you haven't heard from them ever again?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you stay the rest 
of the time in this ghetto? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Not the rest of the time. I was in the-- in 
the hospital, working, yes. But as time went on,  


they cleaned out the ghetto too. People died on 
the street. People died in their houses. And--  


and they-- and-- and-- and I was working 
in the hospital in-- in such a condition,  


that a-- a person cannot even imagine.
And when the time came, they-- they want  

to clean up completely the ghetto. So 
they-- I was left with two brothers and  


one sister. [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] And-- 
and the other ones were already gone. 


And-- and they came-- they vacated the 
houses, and they came over. And they said,  


out you go. Come down. And the-- and we-- you 
are going-- you are going to take just the  


most necessary thing on your self, and you go to 
work. And when we came down, they took us on-- on  


a-- a horse and buggy, and out of the ghetto. 
And on-- on the [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] cattle  


trains, they took us to Auschwitz.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you remember the cattle train  


itself? Can you tell me something about that?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It was horrible, because there was no place to  


sit. There was no windows. They were the despair 
people-- people in despair. We didn't know what's  


going on. We didn't know where we're going. We 
just-- we just thought that we were going to work. 


But we came to Auschwitz. And they said, throw 
everything down, and go into this room. There  


was a shower room. And-- but before that, they 
shaved off all our hair. And my sister-- yeah, and  


they-- they separated the men from the women. They 
took away my brothers, and my sister came with me. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long were you on the 
train going from Lodz to Auschwitz? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I-- I can't tell you, but it was a 
long way. It was a-- a-- a terrible way. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you given any food?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. And so they-- they told us  


to throw away everything, throw down everything on 
a pile, and they shaved the head. And when your--  


a woman is shaved head, she looks different.
I didn't even know that my sister is staying  


with me. And I said, where-- Yetka, where are 
you? Where are you? She say, I'm here. Excuse me. 


So anyway, they took us through the shower 
room, and on the other side they took us out  


on the other side of the-- of the shower room. And 
they said, take one piece of cloth-- of clothes,  


and that's all. And they-- they took us into horse 
stalls, and there we were waiting. And we didn't  


know why, and what for, and whatever. 
And it was terrible. It was terrible. 


They beat us. And they-- [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] 
they-- they just want to destroy us. That's all.  


But they couldn't put everyone into a-- into the 
chambers all together, so we had to wait our--  


our [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] line. So-- and this 
is-- this was every day we came to the counting,  


how to say? You said that word.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>The appell? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Appell, yeah. We had to stay on the 
appell every day, and so on, until--  


until the time came. And it was-- suddenly, we 
hear that it was close to the end of the war,  


and the German women were needed in the front 
to defend-- to defend them. So they had to take  


them out of factories. So they needed a few-- 
200 girl, I think, to supply-- to replace them. 


And I remember there was a-- a-- a table, 
and there were the Germans sitting. And  


we had to be naked completely. And Mengele 
came with his [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] whip,  


and pointed out. This one goes here. 
This one goes here. This one goes here. 


And my sister and-- two sisters and-- 
and a-- a cousin had to go one way,  


and I had to go the other way. And I didn't 
know what for and where. And then we found  


out that they took the other ones on a truck, and 
they, naked as they were, pushed him so tightly,  


that to-- to have more, more. And they took 
him away, of course, to the gas chamber. And I,  


with some other which were-- which were 
chosen to work, so they took us separate. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>When you first arrived in Auschwitz, how 
many members of your family were with you? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Four or five. But my-- my brothers 
were separate. But the girls, we were four,  


I think, because there was a cousin too.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you last see some members of your  


family in Auschwitz?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Did I what? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did-- some members of your family, did 
you see them for the last time in Auschwitz? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Who were they? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Those who were with me. Only I was separated 
to go to work, and the others to destruction. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you the only survivor of your family?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>What kind of work did 
they send you off to do? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> In a factory, where they make little 
reels for airplanes, with a looper on the--  


on the eye. This was the-- the job I had.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was this in a factory near Auschwitz? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yeah.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And how did you get to this factory? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Well, we were known-- this was on the 
[NON-ENGLISH], on the [NON-ENGLISH] from  


Auschwitz-- from Austria to-- by Czechoslovakia, 
close to Czechoslovakia. We went on a train. We  


got a piece of bread, and we went on 
the train. And we came to a factory,  


and this was the factory. And I was by myself.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you didn't return to Auschwitz after  


this?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Then you-- can you tell me what 
kind of work you did in this factory? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> That what I am telling 
you. The reels for airplanes. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And how were conditions in this factory?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Not very pleasant one. We slept on the  


floor on-- with the-- with the straw. And-- 
and we did take-- we did have two meals,  


and very, very simple. And we just exist.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long were you in this factory? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't remember, because then the war was 
very near to a close. And-- and they-- and--  


and when we were on the appell, 
I fainted. And when I fainted,  


then they considered me for-- for the destruction.
There was a-- a-- a-- a little edge with the  


straw, and people who could-- who-- who-- 
who-- who were getting sick, or whatever,  


they were thrown over there. And you couldn't 
see what's going on. And there-- there,  


they died. This-- this was a place 
where they throw them in to die before  


they can take 'em away to the gas chamber. So--
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was the-- was this located near this factory? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, this was in the factory, was 
a-- a-- a place. And-- and I was there,  


and-- and when I came to me, then I heard-- I 
heard some voices, some laughter, some happy  


voices. And I didn't know what's going on.
So I-- I couldn't get up. So I rolled myself  


to a little slit to see what's going on. 
And they were Russian soldiers embracing  


girls and having-- you know, laughing 
and-- and-- and giving them things,  


and so on. So I fainted again. And finally, I 
found out myself-- I find myself in a hospital.  


And this was the first thing of my rescue.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>This was from the Russians? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> From the Russians.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you were placed  


in a hospital under Russian care?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I think I then-- it was with  


the sisters, you know. No, it was rather 
Czechoslovakia. It was rather Czechoslovakia,  


because it was on the border.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long were you in this hospital? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I don't know how long. But when I recovered a 
little, they sent me to Karlsbad for recuperation.  


So I-- I was just like in a stupor, just sent 
from one place to another. And I didn't know  


where and what. You couldn't think then. You 
were just thrown, moved, and things like that. 


And when I was recuperated a little, then I heard 
that they are a group of people in Czechoslovakia,  


in Karlsbad, and in Prague, that they go to 
Israel. So-- and-- and we had-- I didn't have  


a number, because I was designated to the chamber.
So they gave us a-- a little ticket, that  


we are the survivors, so we didn't have to pay. 
And this way I came to Prague. And-- and from  


there, we were trying to get to-- to Israel to-- 
we had to smuggle through Hungary, just a group of  


people. And we couldn't get through, because there 
were Russians on the-- on the [NON-ENGLISH], and  


they said, either you give us vodka, or you give 
us money. Otherwise, we won't let you through. 


We didn't have anything, so they sent 
us back. And when they sent us back,  


they sent us back to the English DP camp. And 
the Englander treated us very badly. So there  


were a group of young people, and they said, 
we heard that an American zone is much better. 


So they went there, and they took me with 
them. And we came to the American zone,  


smuggling. And when I-- we came to the DP camp 
where we-- Bindermichl. And I was completely in  


a stupor. And I didn't know where to go, 
so I was walking, walking. And suddenly,  


I heard someone said, Mirisha?
And I said, who are you? And she said,  


I am Mira. I am the nurse from your hospital. And 
I couldn't remember her, either. And she said,  


what are you doing here? I told her.
She said, you are not going to go any  


further. We are going to take you with us in our 
room, and we will share our-- our ration. And  


it was a-- a beginning. And-- but I didn't 
want to eat from their ration. And I said,  


if I cannot work-- because they-- they were 
working in a-- in an ambulance. And I say,  


if I cannot work in the ambulance, then I'll 
go further. And I don't want to eat your bread. 


So she convinced-- excuse me. She convinced the 
chief [? arts, ?] that I am a good nurse, and  


they took me in. And I did get my own rations.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>From the time you were liberated by  


the Russians, did you make any 
attempt to go back to your home? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Absolutely not. There was no thought about it.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you concerned about  


any survivors from your family?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I was concerned, but I-- there  


was no way that I could find out something.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was this hospital that you worked in,  


was it in the American zone?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It what? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Was it in the American zone?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> The hospital?  


This was in Lodz.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>No, the hospital when you  


had been released from the concentration camp.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Oh, this-- this was a-- in-- in an-- I--  


it was in Czechoslovakia. In 
Czechoslovakia, when they took  


me from-- from the factory to the Czechoslovakia.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you end up, then, in an American DP camp? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Hmm?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you in an  


American DP camp? Where was that?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> This was the-- [PAUSES FOR 7 SECONDS]  


when or where?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Where? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Where? Austria.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>This was in the American zone? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long were you there? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Three years.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you find  


anyone from your home in this camp?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. And we were sending out messages  


and names. We couldn't find anybody.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Were you married at this time? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No. I met my husband in that camp, DP camp.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you were married in the camp then? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How long did you stay in that camp? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Three years.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And where did you go from that point? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> We-- they send-- they-- they-- they 
emptied-- they want to empty the camp,  


and they sent people wherever they want to go. And 
we didn't have nowhere to go, neither my husband,  


neither I. So they sent us to the United States. 
They said, either you'll go to the United State or  


to Australia. And we said, whatever comes 
first, we'll go. So America came first. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you have any family in this country?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, one cousin-- my husband's cousin. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And where did they live?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> They lived in New York. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>How did you end up in Omaha, Nebraska?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It was-- they send us.  


Because they-- they tried to disperse 
the people. We came through to the UNRRA,  


and then they tried to disperse the people where 
they can work. So they said that in Omaha you can  


find a job. And he found a job at the Studebaker.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Did you have any children before you came to  


this country?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Alex. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Alex was born--
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> In-- in displaced  


person camp. I showed you pictures.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And he came here with you,  


then, as a child?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes, one year old. He was  


one year old when we came to New York.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And Alex lives in Omaha today? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> All the time.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Is he married? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes. This is his children.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>He has children. How many  


children does he have?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Three. 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Three children. And your husband passed away?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> My husband passed away in 19-- either  


'89 or '90-- several years ago.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>These experiences have left  


quite a mark on your life, haven't they?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> God in heaven. I don't think that I  


could carry anymore.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Do you think a  


lot about those times?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> It comes to you. It  


affects-- it-- it's a weight in you. And sleep, 
you cannot sleep. I am suffering from headaches  


all the time. My-- I-- I am on medication. I am 
not well, and [PAUSES FOR 5 SECONDS] the end of  


life. [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] A rich life.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Have you enjoyed your life in Omaha? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> There were times when I enjoyed, 
yes. When I was able to help my husband,  


when I was able to have people in my house, when 
we-- we had a house, and somebody guarantee that  


we will pay. And I was working around the 
house. And everything which we had, it was  


a-- a blessing from God. And we worked very hard.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Have you ever wondered why you survived and  


the other members of your family didn't survive?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> I know I don't have the  


answer. [PAUSES FOR 3 SECONDS] Now--
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Has this experience affected your-- 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> The-- the letter to God.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Has this experience affected your religion? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> No.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Have you always had a strong belief in God? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>And you're attending a synagogue currently? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Yes.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Is there anything you would like to add,  


in thinking back of those times?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> What? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>Any advice you would like to give someone?
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> Be good to one another. Don't envy.  


Don't want too much. Be honest. Be decent.
This is my letter to God. A letter to you can  


only have a beginning. But the end, only when we 
finish our task here on Earth. In the first place,  


I want to thank you for the life you have given 
me, and for the ability to see and enjoy the  


myriad of wonders you have created, for growing up 
and growing older, for my dear parents, brothers,  


and sisters, and the rest of my wonderful 
relatives; for the friends of my childhood and the  


present ones; for my dear husband and son whom we 
tried to teach through your beautiful laws of the  


Ten Commandments, the blueprint of noble conduct.
For my new homeland here in the United States,  


after the horrible experiences and losses during 
the Holocaust period. For the renewed faith in  


people, though I will never comprehend how one 
created in your image could turn to an animal  


state of bestiality and hate. If I would try 
to go into details, I would have to thank you  


for the air I breathe, the earth I walk on, all 
heavenly stars, mountains, trees, water, flowers,  


grass. There is no end of things you created.
Now, the second part of my letter will  


be questions which I don't expect to 
understand, for I have only a limited brain,  


and your magnificent design is your greatness. 
Why does a child die before he has a chance  


to experience life's treasures? Why is the 
one deformed-- deformed, while another wins  


a beauty contest? Why is one blessed with 
many abilities, while others are retarded? 


Why is one lucky to be outside of a troubled area, 
while others are caught in the middle? Why does  


one make it, while the other one fails? And on, 
and on, and on. As long as I cannot find answer,  


I shall try to make my choices according to my 
abilities and the circumstances I am in-- to love  


or hate, to struggle through or to give up, to be 
of use or to take advantage of others. All this,  


amid the strong current of emotion to take the 
easy road just to make life easier for myself,  


and to conquer evil inclination.
To relieve my conscience, I can put the  


blame on you, dear God, but I love you too much, 
and the faith I have in you carries me over the  


most painful experiences in my life. In 
closing my letter to you, I will ask you  


to be with me to the end of my days, as I hear 
you in my heart. Yours forever, Miriam, daughter  


of my beloved parents, bless their memory.
This is my picture from the wedding. I am in  


the dress, and my husband is close to me with 
his face. This is a-- a-- a wedding picture,  


which doesn't look like a wedding picture, 
but in the circumstances, it was a wedding.  


And a lot of friends around.
</p></sp><sp><speaker>Ben Nachman</speaker><p>What year was that? 


</p></sp><sp><speaker>Miriam Grossman</speaker><p> This picture was in DP camp, and it was 1947.
This is my son, Alex, bris, in 1948, in-- in the--  


in Bindermichl, in the camp, Bindermichl.
This is my son, Alex. 


This is my daughter-in-law, Mary.
These are my grandchildren-- Sarah,  


in the middle, Joshua on the right side, and 
Daniel on the left side. They are adorable.
</p></sp>



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