Esther Silver Shoah Foundation Testimony

As we talk when the each role of film is 30 minutes, so maybe two three films hour, hour and a half, two hours whatever if whatever we feel like talking. We talk as long as you talk we'll stay here. So when it's 28 minutes of the film he'll tap me on the shoulder and so when we're talking we'll keep talking and then when I that means we'll stop talking and then we change films. If you want to get up and stand up and stretch or get a drink of water. It's no . . .

February 19th 1996. Interview with survivor Esther Silver. My name is Ben Nachman. N-A-C-H-M-A-N. Interview being done in Omaha, Nebraska. Language: English.

Can you give me your name, please?

My name is Esther Silver

And Mrs. Silver When were you born?

September the 20th 1924

And how old are you now?

71

And where were you born?

Będzin Poland Będzin in Yiddish we used to say Będzin

and how do you spell that?

B-E-N-D-Z-I-N

In Poland?

Poland.Yeah.

Can you tell me a little bit about your life in Poland growing up?

Well, I don't remember when I was born. But I was seven years old when I started school I think. In Poland they started by seven not like five here and I went to school I remember her I had three brothers. I was the oldest in the family and the only girl the only girl.

Only girl?

Yeah. My my father and my mother had a little business a little egg business. We made a living. We lived in a big tenement house like an apartment house like in New York. We had a nice apartment. And I was I had a happy childhood. I had a lot of uncles and aunts and cousins. And we used to go and visit on Shabbos and Saturday. We also used to go visit each other had a lot of friends. You know If you lived in an apartment, it wasn't your neighbors. You grew up with the people were like family, you know. They used to take care of you and the parents went away when they were busy. It's not like here. Here's a different life in the United States. That's how I grew up. That's what I remember till 1939. We lived in our place. Our apartment was near a synagogue. In the minute the Germans came in September the first 1939. They burned the synagogue and our apartment got burned too and we lost I remember everything but my mother had two sisters in the same town to aunts. And for a while we stayed with them and then we found a place for our own, on our own. Well during the war, it was very hard.

Did you have a very religious family?

I grew up in a very religious family my father, may he rest in peace, I don't know where his ashes are, he was a [unclear] they used to call [unclear] you know what that means? A small congregation all these religious people had a little room together and this where they prayed every Saturday Friday night and Saturday. And I had two, two grandmothers and one grandfather. My grandparents lived in a small town in Poland and [Jarczówek] it was called, but this was not far and they had a little store they sold materials. Clothing not clothes, but material to make clothes. They were very religious people too. We saw each other very often but during the summertime when we had vacation we used to go there for a whole summer because it was a small town. And we used to be there all summer to spend the summers with them with the grandparents.

How would you get to these

we used to go in a horse and wagon and lately when I was older, it was a bus that used to go there.

Was it a far away?

Well, I I don't know how to tell you like from here maybe to Scottsbluff, Nebraska You know that not too far a few hundred miles kilometers a few hundred kilometers.

And in growing up was your town. Was it a?

A very religious town Będzin was a very Jewish religious town. There were Polacks too, Polish people too.

Did you live mostly within the Jewish community?

Yes, we live near the synagogue I told you yeah the most was all the friends what we had and all the the people around us were Jewish

Yeah, how about your schooling? Was it done?

I went I went to a school It was a public school, but just Jewish kids the girls were a separate school. The boys were in a separate school. I finished is seven classes like you say here seven grades, but it was equivalent I think we were taught more advanced, you know in Poland than here in the United States. It was maybe a good equivalent to a high school because when I came to the United States, I could write and read. And I know people that came before me like your parents Benny. They had a hard time to write and read I think so because I know the family that we came to the uncles and the aunts they didn't know how to write and read very good. I think so. I don't want to say nothing. But that's what I think. This maybe it was easier for us to learn En- English. You know because we know how to write and to read and we adapted easier to the language.

What language was your instruction in in school?

Polish

It was in Polish?

Everything in Polish but religion. We had a special man that taught us well. I personally went a special religious school like [unclear] and I was taught how to read and how to [unclear] and how to write in Yiddish. That's what I was taught I went to two schools during the day I went to one school in the evening. I had to go to a special school to to well not everybody had to. It wasn't mandatory. But I went to this school. My parents wanted me to have the education. So they sent me there. And no, I I married a man from Będzin. And Norman, my husband, may he rest in peace, he went to a school where they taught Hebrew right away, English, Polish, in Hebrew It was called a Yavne and that's where he went to this school.

When you went to this Hebrew school,

yeah,

was this a

Yiddish school, not a Hebrew school

Yiddish school?

It was a Yiddish school.

Was it an instructor that was

oh yeah

hired privately by the family?

Yeah. Yeah, there was a school. They had teachers, women teachers for girls and men to my brothers went to a different set Cheder like you say here. They taught him to English and the Yiddish together in the Cheder, you know, but I went to a separate school

And how much schooling did you complete in Poland before the war?

I told you it was an equivalent like to a high school year. That's what I think the way I see when my kids went to school what they taught them. So I think that it was equivalent to a high school

Can you tell me something about the holidays the Jewish holidays when you were growing up?

This was something different. This we will never have we never had in the United States and we'll never have. Especially Friday in the afternoon the preparing for the Shabbat was so special. You had special clothes. You have special food. Oh, all week you worked hard. You toiled, you know to make a living But Friday afternoon when the Shabbat comes This was something special. We never have this here. We never had it. We never will have it. Actually, I when my kids were growing up. We tried to, well after the war I lost the whole my faith, you know. But when we start to have a family we start to raise and we had to come back to something. We had to give him something to hold on to. We start, I start to light candles. Well, which this I did right after I got married because I had it in me. You can lose your faith, but you can't lose it all together, you know. You always have a little bit in you no matter what you do. No matter how you growed up. So I start to move in the kids. We start raising the kids. We went back, we start to belong right away to a synagogue. We send them right away to Sunday school. My husband actually had a job. Sometimes he had to work on Saturday. When he couldn't go, we sent the kids, you know, they went by themselves. But whenever my husband he loved the synagogue. He loved his religion. He went always went with them, he always wins with them to the synagogue on Saturday whenever he had a chance an opportunity. He always went. In this . . .

Would your family go to the synagogue on Friday night?

My father went to mine and on Saturday to on Saturday

Did the family go did your mother?

I went the kids went my mother not especially but this was not common in Europe like that here, you know, this was . . . They went on the high holidays naturally, but we had a synagogue. They went on the high holidays naturally, but we had a synagogue. I remember my grandmother my mother used to go to the synagogue my grandma, but not my mother.

Can you describe us a Shabbat meal for me?

Well, what should I describe? My mother used to bake challah. My mother used to bake challah. She used to bake all kind of cakes for Shabbos everything. We used to cook you cook chicken soup. Like here and my father used to go to services when he came home he used to always to sing shalom [unclear] which I tell you which I remember I can write, sing it to you by heart. Can, I can picture him pacing back and forth and then he made kiddish [unclear] when we ate a food and after we my father and my brothers used to sing [unclear]. You know, what is this? Which was so beautiful. My mother and me used to do the dishes in the kitchen

Can you tell me about your brothers?

Well, my brothers were younger. Well, I tell you when I left home, I was but not quite 17 years old 16 years old. My brothers were all younger. They were still like in school. And this is the last time I saw them, little little boys. My youngest brother was maybe two three and a half years old when I lived in the ghetto 19- in 19- in 19- 1939 the Germans came. In 1940 was already a ghetto. And I was in the ghetto from 1940 to 1942. And I was in the ghetto from 1940 to 1942.

What were your brother's names?

One was Schmuelick after me and the other one was Alter the youngest one was Herschel.

And they all attended religious school?

Yeah

Can you tell me about this apartment that you lived in?

Well, it was a big apartment place. We lived on the third floor. We had I remember but three rooms. They were all large rooms, you know. We had a kitchen and then one room was like a dining room, but it was bedroom too. I slept there. And there was other rooms, another room. It was a very hard life for my family, I know. But you are a happy family. You're content. We didn't know any better than this was it, you know. But it was a happy life, very happy. I had a lot of love for my parents and I give them a lot of covert a lot of respect. If I saw my mother week, I remember when I was about seven eight years old. If I saw my mother we'd, I remember when I was about seven eight years old. We still didn't have water in our place, you know running water the water was downstairs and we had to carry it up. Whenever I saw my mother carry a bucket of water I went and I took it out from her hand and I tried to carry it up. That's how much we loved our parents. We tried to give them a lot of respect. We didn't know any any other way growing up. We didn't know any other way. This was this that's how we were taught.

Was your father's business conducted at the same location? Was your father's business conducted at the same location?

Yeah. There was a room there that he had this little business was not a big business. We made a living It was very hard. It was very hard. And did people bring him eggs? Yeah, they used to ship it in from a small town in crates. And we used to uncrate and delivered them to stores. That's what said sometimes to private people, you know, especially for Passover. The business was good. He used to sell I remember to a lot of private people.

Did your mother do most of the cooking?

Yeah, yeah. When I started I remember when I was a little bit older, I always helped I watched my mother. But a . . .

And did you have a lot of relatives that live nearby you?

In the same town my my father had three brothers I think three. Three brothers I think three. Yeah. And a sister the sister lived in a different town. And my mother had two sisters and a brother two sisters lived in the same town where we live and her brother lived in the same town where my grandparents lived.

Did the families get together very often?

Usually yeah the summertime most of the time. Yeah, wintertime was hard. It was cold to travel to go, but summertime. But we were close not with all of them you know with the how families you closer with one uncle and aunt and you know with one brother with one, you know I how it's here the United States. I don't have to tell you.

For any of the holidays did the family get together more than just your immediate family?

To me the mostly the immediate family but after a bit in you know after it used to go and visit, you know it's to make a table like you say not piece of cake. He says it's by the table, you know and talk but the kids we were small used to play, used to run around outside and play.

Was there a lot of visiting back and forth between neighbors?

Yeah, the neighbors were this was an extended family. When you need sometimes you got short of something used to go to a neighbor and used to borrow you know something. That's, the neighbors was like family.

Did you live in the same place for a long period of time?

Since I remember yeah growing up in the same place. Yeah, I grew up in the same place.

When did uh you start to notice things changing. Was it the economics getting bad late in the 30s before the war?

1993, in 1933 I want to say we heard it already that Hitler is coming, you know, the German Jews and I remember talking people talking about it, you know, but you didn't want to believe it what you hear, you know. You thought who's going to believe that this is going to happen to us

Did you have any Polish neighbors during this time?

In in our place? Not we had a janitor lady, you know but we lived in just among jewish people

Can you tell me how you felt when late in 1939 when the war began?

Well when we saw the German's coming we tried to run to a different town, but it didn't help. You know. What did you notice the first it was scary. They used to kind of came in, you know, the stormtroopers and the motorcycles were very scared We couldn't go out at night becauseof curfew right away, a curfew right away, you know. That's what it was they started confiscating everything And the first thing they did is burn the synagogue and the people with it all the houses on the block with it. How we escaped that night it really was I don't know it was a miracle. We were all scattered we went to aunts and uncles to hide, you know and the Germans they were shooting the people that ran. And for a couple nights, I didn't know where my parents were. We were all scattered that I went to one and the other kids went to another and we knocked on the door. And we told them what's happening, you know.

How long after the beginning of the war did the German's come to your city?

Right in 1939. I remember like today September the first in 1939 the German's came to our town. And it was right away bad, you know, we didn't we were rationing and we get rations rations everything We had to stay in the life of bread and sometimes you get up early and stayed in the line And when it came the german came if they say we had Jewish they threw us out from the line. It was a very hard time during the war and then they put us in the ghetto and the ghetto was even harder.

Was your father able to continue his business at the beginning?

No, no. In the beginning, maybe yes, but then later on we couldn't do it.

Well, you how were you able to survive at that time?

Well, we survived somehow. Somehow we survived but I wasn't, see I went away in 1942. And I don't know what happened after this the only thing many like it was they had a list from young kids and they needed to send the kids to the labor camps to work and I remember it was called like a I don't have to work to say this in English. Say we knew we heard that they're gonna come and take the kids, you know. My mother was trying to hide me. But I didn't want to go away so when the German's came my mother used to hide me under the bed, you know, and then they came and they asked where I am my mother said i'm not here. So they said to my father if you if I'm not gonna come out where I'm hidden say i'm gonna take you too. And if I heard that, you know, I came out from the hiding place. And I remember they were hitting my father and I started crying my mother started crying. This is the last time I saw her crying, "Don't take my child away." This is how the last time I how I remember her.

Did they take you away at that time?

Yeah, they took me to away. And we went from Będzin from our town to a different town. And this was the camp. It was called a dorkan slager in yiddish. We used to tell it a dorkan slager and over there they assigned us where to go. We didn't know where we're going They put us on a train until they took us to the camp and I went from Poland to Sudetenland. They took me to Oborage that it was called. And when we came there, I remember at night they took us to a big room. We didn't know there were already some girls there in that camp. When I came in 1942, there were already girls there. This was a woman's camp. And we came to the camp and I remember the first night they fed us. You know, they had a dining not a dining room a room and table tables was set and they gave us something to eat. And they assigned us the same night to barracks you know. And then they told us the next day they came they told us we were going to go to work. And they took us right away to the factory. It was a big factory. A spinneret.

You said that you this was in 1942.

Yeah.

Can you tell me about the times between 1939 and and when you were taken away.

I was at home. It was very very hard. You were scared every day. We were never sure with our life what it's going to be. We were never sure what was going to be we were together the family. Somehow we lived I don't know many how we did it, but we did it. What should I tell you?

What were you living at this time because you said your house

In a ghetto

was in a ghetto.

Yeah, we had one room.

When did they form this ghetto?

In 1940

1940?

Yeah.

Did you move into the ghetto at this time?

Yeah, we didn't have too much belonging what the family gave us, you know. We had one room and we stayed in that room. This was your mother your father and three brothers and yourself myself

Can you tell me about the ghetto? Was it a walled-in ghetto?

It was out of town a little bit. It was out of town a little bit. It was called Kamyanka What can I tell you? What can I tell you? We stayed there. We couldn't go out, you know and we stayed there.

Were you able to do any kind of work in this ghetto?

Well, some people worked older people there was a it came a big German firm they you had to have a car not everybody could get a car to work them and the people that it didn't work in them, I think they send away right away to the labor camps a lot of people.

During this period of time did any of your extended family get sent away that you knew of?

I think we all still were in the ghetto together, you know. The most of them. When I I was the first one I think to go to that camp from my family. And then later on I think a lot of a lot of people were able maybe to work went I don't know what happened after this.

How were you able to survive as far as food when you were in the ghetto?

Well we got ration cards, you know what we could we buy. We ate what we could. We survived somehow.

Were you able to save any of your home furnishings?

Everything got burned when but some family give us someone give us a bed, you know, whatever they shared with us In the ghetto what we had we didn't need much we had one room.

And where did you get the funds to buy food with?

I tell you Benny I don't remember maybe my parents had savings. You know something. I really don't remember what it was I can't tell you. It's so many years and sometimes you want to remember things you can't. Maybe I blocked it out. Maybe I blocked it out. I don't want to remember. Bad things you don't want to remember when sometimes

How did they form a udon rot in this ghetto? How did they form a udon rot in this ghetto?

Yeah, it was a committee my Jewish committee they helped the people, you know. There was some it was ways to do it. Probably.

Did you know any of the members of the udon rot?

I don't I don't remember this.

Do they seem do they seem to help the people in the ghetto?

It was a Jewish committee that used to help, you know

Were there a lot of deaths in the ghetto at this time?

I don't remember this. I don't remember this. Well people died every day like here

And you were located outside of Będzin at this time?

Yeah. It was called Kamionka in this border the ghetto was yeah.

Was it a great distance outside of?

Well a couple kilo and not kilo. I mean it was maybe a half hour's work from town to this to this other place

Do you have any idea the number of Jewish people in this ghetto?

I don't know There are a lot of them were gone already. You know to camps to other camps they used to catch them in the street, you know And put them to the camp to take them to work

When they took these people away to work did they ever return? When they took these people away to work did they ever return?

I don't know I can't tell you

Was there a Jewish police force in this?

Yeah, it was a Jewish police force. We had a whole committee that used to take care of the town But the Polacks were terrible some of them

How about the Jewish police force? How did they treat the people in the ghetto?

They had the, they was told what to do they had to obey the Germans, you know, if not, they got they got it further, you know you had to obey them. Whatever they told you they had to fulfill the policeman.

You said you were the first member of your family taken away.

Yeah, that's what I remember. Yeah, I didn't know about the others. Maybe right after me thing But I was fortun. . . I went to a labor camp And that's how I survived. I was working and that's how I survived.

from that point on when you were taken away did you ever hear any more from your family?

From the first maybe couple months my mother used to write me a post postcard. And I think she was told what to write. I think they censored this because it was always written. We are fine. We are still here. You know, this was a at first. And later on I didn't hear nothing.

How did you go from the ghetto to this labor camp?

Well, I told you I had I had to take him to look for me. Then I I had to go so I went. They they took us to a big place. There were just girls there just girls from our town. And from there we said we're sent to another town to Sosnowitz. And this was it's called in German adorcan slagger, you know. And from there they decided I didn't decide where I want to go.

How did they transport you from on a train to Sosnowitz?

No from from Sosnowitz. I think too and on the train or we walked I think I don't I think we walked. It was three kilometers three four kilometers and I think we walked different from Będzin to Sosnowitz.

Were you with anyone that you knew at that time?

Girls from our town. I knew yeah. But everybody was sent to a different place.

Were there any men involved?

In the place no where I was no men just women.

And you did you stay in Sosnowitz for any length of time?

Not long, maybe a week. A week before there the Germans decided where they want to send they didn't send everybody in the same place. They divided us.

Was it a labor camp at all in Sosnowitz?

I don't remember. We didn't do nothing, just stayed in the barracks. They had barracks there, too. We were waiting till they sent us away. We didn't know where we're going to go. Nobody knew.

Then when they sent you away from there, how did you travel?

On a train.

Do you remember was it a long journey?

I think so. Maybe we didn't know where we're going and there were German policemen on the trains and they were watching us And until we came to that place at night, it was called. I know [unclear]. We came there at night. That they fed us because we didn't have nothing to eat all day. I don't remember really how long it took us to get there, Ben. I, I remember we came at night and there were right away assessment there, you know, even that they took care of us. They told us we have next day. They assigned us to barracks, you know. In the next morning right away they took us to work. They divided everybody went out to work in a different place. But when we came to this camp there were already girls there from the region where I was, you know.

The girls that were there had they been there very long?

I don't remember how long they were there maybe a few months.

Did you were you able to stay with anyone that you knew at this time?

They assigned the rooms but I stayed with a few girls from our town that were and I met people like from Sosnowitz, you see. This was not far. Sorry, but I don't remember. I think 35 girls in one room. There were bunk bunks, you know three high. In the morning we got up. The facilities I don't have to tell you. Okay, you want me to stop?

Interview with Mrs. Esther Silver, Tape 2 Mrs. Silver, can you tell me about the barracks you were in at the labor camp?

Well, they're from wood, wooden barracks. There was a big, like, nothing. Well there were halls, you know, like barracks are. Sorry, what should I tell you? Well, there was a d- where we got our food. In the morning, what we did get I don't remember, we got rations. Every week they gave us for a whole week a piece of bread. And during, when we used to come from work, they used to give us a couple of potatoes, you know, and a little bit soup. This was our whole day's food in the morning. I don't even remember. They gave us the bread, so we had to divide it for a whole week, you know, that we should have it. Sometimes you were hungry, you would even get one day. It was a very, very, the camp was very bad, but it wasn't like in Auschwitz, you know.

Were you hungry all the time?

Most of the time, yeah.

What were the facilities in it? Did they have facilities for bathing?

No, we went like a, they had a shower. For a- Like one shower, a big room. And all the girls, a lot of them went together, you know. Maybe once a week, maybe. It was very, we were very, we tried to keep ourselves clean, you know. But how could you, under the circumstances, we tried our best, you know.

What type of clothing did you have there?

Well, I had a uniform, like you're saying. It had a star of David on it. Most of the time, we had to wear this. But I had a little bit underclothes, things like that. I brought still from home. When I went away, I brought it from home.

Were you able to wash your clothing?

Once in a while, you do it in the sink. You try, you know, women always try to do the best, they find a way to do it, you know.

Were there any other prisoners other than Jewish prisoners?

No. In this camp were just Jewish girls, where I was.

How were you treated there at this camp?

Well, we were treated like in any, any, we had to behave. They counted us every day. In the morning, I used to have to go to work. I had to walk a long way to work. And we went all together, you know. We marched, like in marching, we went together to work. And we stayed all day. We went in the morning, around 6:30. We came home at night.

How many days a week did you work?

Except Sunday, I think we didn't work. Sunday. Work. Work. Every day except Sunday.

What did you usually do on Sundays when you weren't working?

Well, you tried to clean up your room. You had to clean the best we could, you know. And late, we stayed in bed. We reminisced from home. We were thinking constantly of our families, of our parents, where they are. How we, when we will get out of here, how long we'll be able to work like this. It was very hard work. But I was young and I was able to survive.

Were you hearing any rumors about the war or what was happening to the communities?

You couldn't hear too much, but when the Germans got licked, we got licked too. You know what I mean? They took it out on us. That's what it was. They made us work harder. They made us stay outside longer, you know.

Were there any heating facilities during the wintertime?

I don't, I don't, I think we had a, not a stove. From iron or something, I don't remember. I tell you, I don't remember. In the middle of the room was an oven, like an oven to heat it up. We used to try to heat, to have a little bit of heat during the wintertime.

Were there many girls in this room?

Yeah, 35 girls in one room.

And you were very crowded.

Yeah, sure.

Were there any girls that passed away during this period?

Some of them, yeah. They used to come every month and check us. And who wasn't healthy, they took them away, they couldn't work.

Did you ever know where?

Well, when they took them, they say they took them to Auschwitz. If they were not, they didn't have any use for us. That's where they sent you.

Were they bringing, were they ever bringing new prisoners into this camp?

No, when I was there, not- before the war, close, before the war was over, you know. Maybe six months before they combined two camps together. In this room, I found my cousin, Frida, from it. She came from another camp. She was together with me.

Were she also from your same town?

Yeah, and I didn't even know she was alive, that she was in the camp. And that's where we found each other.

Did she have any information from the family?

No, she knew the same thing what I knew. She maybe went away a month later than I did. And she knew the same thing what I did.

Was there any discipline that was done in this camp?

Well, we had to behave, we had to do what they had tell us to do. We had to work and do what they told us.

Were there any ones that were punished for anything?

Well, if you tried to run away, you were punished. They had big dogs and they had these wires, gates, you know, what you call them, fences. There were people, SS women, that were watching us.

And how were you treated by these SS women?

Well, when they had a chance to beat us, they beat us, but you tried to avoid it. You tried not to be bad, and to listen what they say, not to get beat. You had to look out for yourself. If not, you couldn't survive, Benny.

Was it a long walk to go to your employment? To work? To work?

Yes, yeah.

And what kind of work did you do?

I worked on a spinnerei. It was called in German. They made yarn from flacks. And they had a lot of department. And every few girls, everybody worked in a different department. I was working when the flecks were already processed and went through to pipes of water and spools. And they made yarn out of it already. And I had to watch. It was a big machine. And I had to watch that everything is threaded, that the yarn goes on the spools. You know, sometimes the thread broke, and I had to put it together. When the machine was, the thread was full, the spools, the machine used to stop. You stopped it. You took it off. You put another one. This was going on all day like this, all day. Sometimes you need to go to a bathroom. You had to go to the, it was called the Lagerführerin. You know, the woman that was watching us. You had to tell her. And you couldn't stay long. You went, you did the business, and you had to come back right away.

Were you fed at all at this work site?

During the day, not too much. They used to bring us some food, a little bit maybe, a little bit of soup. And that's what was it.

Were you given any breaks during the day?

No. We work all day. The machines went all day, from morning till night. They even had night shifts, too. Some girls worked at night, I remember.

What would they do with this thread when they finished with it?

Well, they took it away someplace. I don't know what they did with it. It was a big company, thermal clover. It was very normal in Sudetenland. They had this before the war, these factories, you know. But they needed people to work in it, so they took cheap labor. They had the Jewish girls doing for it.

How long did you work at this factory?

Since I was there for three years, from 1942 to 1945. For three years, it went on like that.

Did conditions change at all in the camp?

Well, sometimes it was worse, and sometimes it was better, you know. Different times. But I don't know if I was lucky or not. Somehow I survived.

When were you liberated from this camp? When was it?

May the 9th, 1945, I remember. Exactly like today.

And who liberated you?

The Russians. We went out, we got free. We didn't know. Then there was a field. The Germans used to put, for winter, potatoes in the ground. They shouldn't be frozen. There was a field with potatoes, and we were like, wild. We went out, and everybody picked up. We were hungry. We didn't know, so we picked up a few potatoes, and we took it in, in the barracks. Well, the Russians fed us, you know. But the Russians were not potato, especially for young girls. I don't want to tell you what happened, you know. And I didn't stay there long. They had a big warehouse that the Germans wrapped from the Jewish business people, and they brought it there, to Germany. And there was a big warehouse there. They stored things. So we stormed in there, and we took whatever we could, you know. We didn't have any clothes. We didn't have nothing. And there were some German women that were dressmakers. We went to them. They made us some clothes. And I stayed there maybe two weeks in Oberaustat, and I went right to look for my family, me and my cousin Frida. That's where we were together from this time.

Did the people that ran the camp, did they leave before the Russians got there?

Some of them, I think, the women, yeah. Yeah, they ran away. They left us alone, yeah. But the Russians came. I don't remember how this was.

Were the Russians able to capture any of the Germans?

I don't know. I can't tell.

How long did you remain at this camp after the Russians came?

About two weeks, yeah. We didn't know what to do or where to go. But then we decided, my cousin Frida and me and another couple girls from our town, that we're going to go home. And how we did it, I don't know. I really, sometimes, you know, I used to talk to Norman. Norman, how did I come to Będzin I know, I remember we went on freight trains, you know. We were asking the conductors where the freight trains are going. And we told them where we want to go, and they were traveling there. And we went back to Poland. I remember I came to Będzin on a freight train. We came to the station. We were told we're going to see some people from our town, you know. But we didn't see nobody. So we went out on the street. We were asking, you know, if somebody's here, where to go, we didn't know. So it was already a Jewish committee, you know. And they told us where to go. We went and there were some people from our town. Everybody that wanted to go and find families. And they found some people that I knew. And they told me where my parents went. My whole family went to Auschwitz.

That is your mother?

My father and my three brothers. I went to a caretaker from, they took care of the building. And I knocked at her door. When she opened the door, she got startled. She said to me like that, They took your whole family to Auschwitz, and you are still in my life? She pointed with the finger to me. She would see a ghost coming back. Well, when I came to Poland, there were already Jewish people of you and Będzin, you know. People that we knew. And people used to come and go. We didn't stay long there. Because we didn't have nothing to do there. The Russians were there, you know.

How were the Polish people treating you at this time?

Not too good. Not too good. One day, I was staying, me and my cousin. One of my mother's sisters came back. We were together in Landsberg, and then she went to Los Angeles. She passed away already. She was 47 years old. She passed away.

Was she able to tell you anything about the family at all?

The same thing. She was married before the war. She lost her husband. She was in Ravensburg, I think, in a camp. She lost her husband. She didn't have any children.

How long did you remain in Będzin?

Będzin, I tell you. About six weeks, I think.

Did you have a place to stay there?

Yeah, we took a room, you know. Me and my cousin, my aunt, Helen. We stayed in the room. Then we got together a whole group of people. We went back. We wanted to go back to Germany. To the West, they were the American zone, you know. Germany was divided, I don't have to tell you. In three zones, you know. It was an English, an American, and a Russian. And we went back to the American zone. We traveled. I don't know, we did. We went from Będzin, from Poland. We went to Czechoslovakia. On trains, too. We smuggled ourselves, like you say. We didn't have any papers, any nothing. From there, we went to Czechoslovakia. In Będzin, when I came, I met Norman. My husband.

Did you know Norman before the war?

No. In the group, you know. That's where I met him. The group of kids.

Was he from Będzin?

Yeah. And I met Norman. ___ they used to call him in Yiddish. And we all, a whole group of people got together, and we went back to Germany.

How long did that trip take you? Do you remember?

Well, I think September. We got to Landsberg. It took us a couple months. Then we went from Prague. We went to Plzeň (Pilsen). Pilsen. And in Pilsen, we stayed in a camp. And there were some other refugees with great people, all kind of people there in that camp. And we stayed there for a couple, maybe a month.

Were you listening to other stories of other survivors at this time?

Well, everybody went almost through the same thing, you know. And the people we were, we knew each other, you know. They were this group. We were together. And I remember we were in Pilsen. We had to go from Pilsen to Munich. And we didn't have any transportation. So they came. American soldiers with trucks. There was a chaplain, a Jewish chaplain there. And he didn't want to believe us that we are Jewish. We didn't have any identification. So, you know, they knew what he did. He took us one by one to a room. And he opened a prayer book. He told us to say a few words. So I was telling to myself, I said, my God, if I wouldn't know how to say prayer words, he wouldn't believe me that I'm Jewish. You know. He opened a prayer book, the chaplain. He told us to say a few Hebrew words. And then he took us on trucks. And we went from Pilsen to Munich on trucks. It is what I remember.

During this period of time, where were you able to get food while you were there?

Well, they fed us. I think it was maybe through the Red Cross. That they took care of us. The Red Cross. We had food there, you know, and they gave us rooms to stay, facilities. It was a camp there too. Maybe it was for German soldiers. I don't know what it was.

Were these mostly young people?

The most of them, yeah.

Did you find any very, very young people that had lost families, very young children?

Most of them. The most of them were young people. Most of them were my age, you know, and Norman's age.

And when you left Czechoslovakia, where did you go?

I told you, from there we went to Munich. From Munich, we went to Landsberg, right away. We wanted to go there. And that's where the DP camp, you know. And the DP camp, I stayed from 1945 to 1949. In the meantime, I married Norman in 1946. We came there in 1945, late, like September. In the next March, 1946, we got married.

Did either you or Norman have any family?

No. I had that end, we were together, my cousin Frida. We were always together. We tried.

Did Norman have any family left?

Norman had a brother that went during the war. He went to Russia. He ran away from Poland and went to Russia. Norman knew that he had a brother. He was in Russia, but we didn't hear from him. When he found out, Norman found out that his brother is alive through his family in the United States in Omaha, here.

How did Norman, Norman knew that he had family here?

But he didn't knew the others. So one day, the postman, we were still in Poland, in Będzin. The family from here, they wrote a postcard to Będzin. They didn't know if somebody is there or not. They wrote it just in the world. If it comes, it comes. And by chance, Norman had to meet the postman that day. And the postman saw Norman. He says, you know what? I have for you a postcard from America. And that's how Norman found out the address. This is before I was married. That's what Norman told me. And he found out that he had family here, and he started writing to them. He had an uncle in California. And that uncle, he wrote to him first. And he wrote him up. He was not such a well-to-do man, you know. And that uncle wanted that Norman should come to America, you know. So he wrote him, I can't send you any papers. I am not a wealthy man. But you have wealthier relatives in Omaha, Nebraska. So you write to them, and maybe they will take you to America. And in the meantime, I got married to Norman. And then in the meantime, Norman's brother found out that Norman is alive, through America, too. And he came from Russia. And I remember the day he came like today. May they both rest in peace. They are now together. Norman wasn't home. And somebody, my brother-in law. And somebody, my brother-in law. Norman's brother, went from Russia to Schriesheim. And from Schriesheim, people used to come to Germany, back to Landsberg. And then Norman, a man came from Schriesheim, and he told Norman, you know that your brother is alive. And then we got in contact with him, you know. And I remember the day he came. Norman wasn't home. And I didn't want him to get too excited, you know. I knew he was coming, but I didn't know what time, when, you know. And Norman wasn't home. And I was home and my cousin, Frida. Well, I knew from pictures how you look. I knew about him and everything. Then he came to the camp, to Landsberg, and I heard. And I went looking for Norman. I didn't want him to come home and see his brother, you know, because I thought, God forbid he could get a heart attack. So I went looking for him. And I found him. I prepared him. You know, we knew he was going to come. So I says, Norman-- in Yiddish I told him. Don't get excited. Your brother is already here. He is now in a room, you know. And we made him comfortable, you know. And then I will never forget the minute when Norman came and found his brother, we were all staying in the hall and crying. Neighbors that lived across the hall in Landsberg, you know. This was our reunion. And since then, he was with us. We were all together, me and Norman. I was already married. We only had one room in Landsberg. So I was living there and Norman and my cousin, Frieda, was always with me from it. From the first day that I met her in the camp, we were like sisters, never separated, until we came to the United States, then when we separated. So we were all together. And then Norman's brother, I had a good neighbor, and her name was Genia Klein. She was from Dumbo. And we got them together. They got married in Landsberg, too. My cousin, Frieda, got married to Zachary Katne in Denver, Colorado. And she passed away already, too. She was like a sister to me. And I miss her a lot.

Can you tell me about your wedding? What?

We had a wedding. We had just people we knew. We didn't have any relatives, except my cousin, Frieda, and my aunt. We had a wedding.

Who performed the ceremony?

We had a rabbi. We performed the ceremony. We made what we could. Norman had one cousin. She lived in Sternberg. And she came to the wedding, too. We had a wedding. We had music. We had everything. We had a lot of friends.

Was the rabbi a chaplain?

No, no. A very orthodox man. I think he was from Hungary. A survivor. I even had the Ketubah still, Benny. I went to look for papers. I didn't even know I brought it into the United States. After Norman passed away, I was looking for things. And I found it. It's in Hebrew, and I show it to you if you want.

How long did you remain in this camp until you were able to come to this camp?

Well, I tell you, I was married in 1946, March 19th. Then we started to... Norman started to write to the relatives to send us papers. Well, it took a little time. In the meantime, I got pregnant, and I had Michael. So they had to... First, they had to send other papers because we got married. And then we had a child, you know. So it took three years, from 1944, from 1945 to 1949. It took us four years to come here.

How were conditions in this DP camp?

Well, we were taking care of each other, you know. We had freedom. But it was not a life like you live before the war. You didn't have any family. It was different, altogether different.

And you were provided food by the Americans?

Yeah, yeah, we managed, you know, a little bit. Some people used to have a little business, and one did this, and one did this. We could manage for ourselves.

Did you do your own cooking there, or did you eat in a community?

I did my own cooking, and we had our own. I took care of my baby, you know, and everything.

And what did your husband, Norman, do during this time?

Nothing, not much. He worked for the, like a community center there in the camp, you know. He did a little bit of work. Most of the time, he didn't do much.

And when you came to this country, it was 1949?

Yeah, June 26, 1949.

And you came to Omaha, Nebraska?

We came to the Kenners. You know, Norman had family here. Two aunts. They were his father's sisters. And they came here, I think, maybe 1940, 1950. I don't know when they came. When we came to them, we didn't come to the Jewish community center in Omaha. We came directly to them. And I remember there was a mix-up in the date, in which day we had to come. It was Sunday. We came to Boston on the boat. And from Boston, we took a train to Chicago. And I remember from Chicago, we came to Omaha. It was overnight. And we came to the railroad station. We didn't see nobody waiting for us, you know. The days got mixed up, and they didn't know. We're waiting, we're waiting. And I says, how will we get there? And I says, how will we get there in Yiddish to Norman. Norman was very disappointed, may he rest in peace, that nobody came to see us, you know, to wait for us. So we had the address written down. So we were waiting. And nobody came. I had a baby. Michael was a baby. He was 18 months old. So we went outside. We couldn't speak too much English. And we took a taxi. I saw a taxi. I yell a cab. So I give the man the address, and I told him, take me to this address, you know. I didn't know. So my aunt used to live in South Omaha by that time. We came to the aunt's door. Nobody saw. So they had a party, a doing, I don't know. And the door was closed. Some neighbor saw us, like, well, we paid the cab. We had some money, you know, in Chicago. They gave us some money. We didn't know how much to pay him, so we told them, take how much you want. I didn't know. So we came. We knocked on the door. Nobody was home. Saw a neighbor. So that we are there, and the neighbor probably knew that we had to come. Refugees had to come, you know. So she called her daughter. The daughter came around. And later they apologized. The days were mixed up. They didn't know when we were supposed to come. So I remember it was a hot day in Omaha June, 26. That's when we came here. When we came here, we stayed a couple of weeks in South Omaha with my aunt Sarah, may she rest in peace. She was a lovely woman. But we weren't happy to stay with them. We were at a place on our own. It was very hard to find an apartment. So we stayed and we found an apartment. Our first apartment was on 20-20 Hanne Street. Downstairs was a bar, and we were living upstairs. And the mice were running around, and cockroaches were running around. What should I tell you? Well, naturally they tried to do the best for us what they can. Norman had a hard time finding a job. Norman was very unhappy. So he went to work the first job. It was her upstairs, you know, the commercial optical. He was grinding lenses there. Norman got an exam in a sense, and he couldn't work there. You had to have your hands in the water all the time. So he couldn't work. And they had my uncle Kenner. You know probably whom I'm talking about. He had a funny kiss on South Omaha. Lee of Hacks had a big upholstery factory. And they were throwing around Norman. He was always so unhappy because of that. Like a football. He says, you're giving my job? He says, you're giving my job. So Kenner gave my job, and I took to deliver refrigerators. Norman came from hell. So they gave him my job. He couldn't do this work. So he came home. He says, Uncle, I didn't work. My back hurts. I'm not a real man. I can't do this work. So they had a conference with relatives. And Uncle Hacks said to Norman, I take it to my factory. So he gave him the first job, stopping questions. And he paid him 65 cents an hour. I'm sorry, Benny. I'm talking with my Norman. And he asked me, he probably wouldn't let me talk like this. He never wanted any pity from Norman. Like my son, when he was sent by Michael to college the first year, I told you, like he told me, Mother, you don't know how proud I am of you. You're sending a son in college. You're supporting him. You are indebted to Norman. And 10 grand, whatever you see here, is with our own. 10 fingers and two hands. And he started to work at the factory. He worked there for a lot of years. He wanted to have a trade. Stopping questions was not a trade. So he went to his uncle. He told him, Uncle, I wanted to learn the trade. You know, maybe in time I will go for myself. I don't know what I'm going to do. But teach me the trade. So he told him, if you want to teach your trade, you have to start working piecework, like all the other posters. Norman didn't know how to do anything. So by that time, there wasn't compressors yet when he came. You know, he had to spit a text from the mouth. I don't know. Or you know what I'm talking to you. You took a bunch of text in your mouth, and you sent it out with a magnetic hammer, and you pound it in the furniture, you know? That's what he used to do. So I remember he used to come home, and he says, Uncle, put me on piecework. And I don't know how I'm going to come out, at least at least here. I make $40 a week, $50 a week, you know? He used to work overtime to go in every hour, you know, that we should come to something. So he says, I don't care how much you make. I went to work. I work for Fairmont Wood.

Three. Mrs. Silver, when you landed in Boston, did anyone meet you there?

People from the HIAS, I think, and they told us which train to take. They put us on the train. And I think they give us some spending money to have. We didn't have any money. From Boston, we went on the train to Chicago. And from Chicago, we came on the Union Station in Chicago. We rested a little while, I remember. I needed to feed the baby. So there was a restaurant, and there was a waitress, and she spoke German. And I spoke there, so she brought me some milk for the baby. And then we came to Omaha.

Did somebody meet you in Chicago?

I think people, too, from the HIAS. That's what I think they said they were from.

And after you were here a while, and Norman started to work, can you pick up that story and tell me?

Well, Norman finally went to work for his uncle in the shop. Nobody wanted to give him a job. Nobody wanted to help us, because we came to relatives. So the Jewish Community Center didn't want to have nothing to do with us. We didn't came like the other people, you know. They provided. They see that other people should have a job. But we came to relatives, and they knew them, you know. So they put the whole burden. They send us to them- That's all. Well, Norman was not very happy with his job. What should I tell you? But he learned the trade. He picked up. Norman had a fabulous mind. Norman could've been anything. When we came here, somebody told us, you can go to night school. You can be a bookkeeper. You can be a CPA. You can be anything, you know. Norman could have picked up. We were young. We were now in our 20s, you know. Norman could've gone to school, but nobody told us to do this. So we had to make a living, you know. We had a baby. We were on our own. Well, the relatives, they did what they knew that they could. Maybe they could do more. What should I tell you? You know them, and you know their, you knew probably their situation better than we, you know. So they gave him a job, and in time, for a few years, he was just cushions, cushions, you know, for the couches. He made the cushion, not sewing them, filling them. He was filling them with cotton and springs by that time. And then one day he came home, and he says he had a talk with his uncle, that we can't make a living for that money that he's making. He wants to learn the trade and make more money. So he told them, you have to go and work, piece work like any other man here works, it was not a big shop, you know, he had about 10, 15 people working for him. And Norman went, he started working out. Well, first, it was hell, what should I tell you? And we moved in, in the meantime, we found another apartment, and we moved in, we crossed the street from Cooper's, you know, Park Avenue. We had a nicer place, but it was hard too. We lived on the second floor, and had a small baby. The baby wanted to walk, and the lady downstairs, didn't like it. So I had to go out, and he had to walk, I had to go out with him on the street, you know, that he can play on the street, not in the house. Well, and then in the meantime, I went to work with Herman's foods to try to help out, and I put Michael in the nursery school. We go to work, and we try to save some money. Norman tried to learn the trade.

What kind of work did you do at Herman's foods?

I went to work with Herman's foods, in Omaha. You remember, they used to make ice cream, and I used to work in the ice cream department. There was a pipe that go down the ice cream, came down to a pipe, and I used to hold the cartons under, and fold them, and send them on the line, you know. That's what I did. And I worked there for quite a few years, till I got pregnant with my other son. In the meantime, we tried to save some money. We tried to, you know, to do the best we can, to make a life for ourselves. We weren't happy the first day, the first year. Later on, you know, you raise children. You want to show them a happy home, and happy parents. You want to give them a good environment, to raise them in a good environment. So we tried our best, what we could. Well, the kids were good. I had two sons. Michael was born in Germany, you know, and he was born the year 1953. Well, we lived in the apartment with two kids, and we wanted a house. So the first house is always hard, and you buy the best you can, you know. So this was the house on 38th and Seward. It was a big house, and upstairs was an apartment. We rented it out with help with the payments. We lived in the house for 20 years, and it was happy 20 years, because I raised my kids there. And the kids were good. We always were happy there. When we moved out, Norman used to tell me, if every corner could talk, it would tell a different story. That's what we always used to talk. Well, Michael went to grade school. Then he went to Franklin grade school. He went to Central High School. Michael was a very good student. Michael and Eddie are almost seven years apart. Michael was a very good student. He had nice friends, and he was a good son. So was Eddie. Growing up was good, too. He was a good son, too. But we have two children. They're both different. I don't have to tell you this.

What is Michael doing today?

Michael is a school superintendent in Seattle, Washington, in the Parkway School District. When Eddie worked, he worked for a radio station. Now he went to a different job. He's doing something different.

And where's he living?

Eddie lives in San Francisco. Michael lives in Seattle, Bellevue, Washington.

Do you see your sons very often?

Yeah, twice a year, at least.

Do you talk to them very often?

On the phone very often, yeah.

Do you have grandchildren?

I have four grandchildren. Three boys, and my darling granddaughter, Sabina.

So you have a very nice family. You have a great deal to be proud of. I am proud.

We are proud. Norman would be proud. He misses a lot.

Now that you've been able to relate to me the story of your life, the tragedies, and the good times,do you have a message that you could leave?

What? For my kids? I want to tell my kids. They had a very good background. I came from a religious background. Norman's parents were not orthodox, but with our beautiful family. They would be very, very proud of their grandparents. We were very, very sorry that our parents didn't live to see their grandchildren, I always said that my mother would live and see that I have two kids. When I was raising them, I was always thinking about it. She never lived to see it. I don't know if she knew or she knows. I was always talking to my husband. My parents, you parents, my parents would live to see that we are married, and I am married. We have two kids. We make a living. We try to give the best to our children because I want to tell you one thing. We didn't have much in our lives. When we were raising our kids, we always tried to give them more than we had. So we sacrifice for ourselves and try to give our children. My kids are doing the same thing. They want to give their children things that they didn't have because when we were raising our kids, we couldn't afford to do. We couldn't afford to buy our son, when he was 16 years old, a new car, like maybe some of his friends had. You know, between kids is always jealousy, but we always try to explain to our kids the best way we could. Norman always says that jealousy is a sickness. Benny- Norman's relatives were very well to do, but we were never very jealous. We went to the houses, what they have. We were happy with what we have because we knew we were doing it ourselves. Nobody is giving this to us. You know how hard my Norman used to work? Norman used to make hideaway beds. This had a big iron construction, 10 hideaway beds a day. He used to work like I sometimes I hollered at him. I says, you don't have to do this. He says, what? That's I'm doing it, you know. He used to come, summer time. There wasn't any air conditioner. He used to come home. I don't have to tell you, you work in a big building downtown. The heat is high, it's hot, you know. There were fans, they didn't have any air conditioner. He used to come home. He was wet, he was stuck to his shirt, you know. But he did it because he knew he had to support our family and we didn't know. He wanted to be indebted to nobody, you know. We did it on ourselves by ourselves.

Mrs. Silver, I'd like to thank you for allowing us to come into your house and get this information from you.

I wish that I want to tell the kids. I wish that their father was sitting with me. They know how much I miss him and nobody, nobody knows just me, but they know too. They miss their father. I'm sure that they're missing them. Every Sunday they miss his voice. This was my lot and I couldn't help it. I hope I was a good wife to my husband. I was a good mother to my kids. That's what I hope. I tried my best. I told my boys I raised you the best way I know how. Maybe I didn't know any better, so.

I know you did a real good job, Mrs. Silver.

I don't know. I tried my best. Thank you very much. Yeah, and you didn't see Norman's thing.

Mrs. Silver, can you tell me about this photograph?

Well, this is a picture when me and Norman got married in Landsberg in 1946, March 19, 1946.

Mrs. Silver, can you tell me about this?

Well, this is the ketubah that the rabbi gave us when we got married. It's written all in Hebrew. We got married around 7 o'clock in the evening. That was in Landsberg.

Can you tell me about this photograph?

We took it once. I don't remember when. We just went, we took a picture.

Of you and your husband, Norman?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Mrs. Silver, can you tell me about this document?

Well, my husband was very sick and he was dying. And the kids wanted to have his number. So they took it down and they made it for us. I remember and that they should never forget Norman was in Auschwitz and it was very important for them and for their kids too.

This was his number in Auschwitz?

Yeah, in Auschwitz, yeah.

Mrs. Silver, can you tell me about this photograph?

Well, this is Michael and Beverly and my two grandchildren, his two kids, Sabina and Joey. We love them all. We are very proud of them.

Can you tell me about this photograph?

This is my younger son, Ed, and his lovely wife, Dorothy.

Can you tell me about this photograph?

This is Eddie's son, Robin. He's three. He's going to preschool already. This is Eddie's second son. His name is Jay, Jason. He's a sweet baby too. He's a sweet baby too.