Bea Karp Walnut Middle School Testimony

Excellent. Okay. Hi Walnut Middle School.

Hi.

My name is Kael Sagheer. I’m the Education Coordinator at the Institute for Holocaust Education, and you're going to be listening to Bea Karp today. She is one of our Holocaust survivors that lives here in Omaha, and we were just chatting before and she was telling me that she really feels compelled to share her story because of all the prejudice and hate that is still going on in the world. This is something that means a lot to her so if you could give her your full attention for the next 45 minutes or so, then she's going to take some questions when she's done. Okay?

Okay.

Okay, thank you. I’m going to move the computer. There we go.

Okay.

And you can sit back if you want to. Don't feel like you need to strain. I’ll make it see you. Okay? All right.

Okay.

Go ahead.

Hello everybody.

Hi.

A very long time ago, I was born in Germany in a small town by the name of Lauterbach. My family consisted of my parents and a sister who was younger than I am by three years. We lived in a town, in a small town, Lauterbach was a small town, but sadly enough, there was a lot of anti-Semitism. And after a while, my parents decided they had enough and we left, we, we moved to a bigger city in Germany by the name of Karlsruhe. The reason we moved there was we had a family there. It was the brother of my father and, and his family. When we arrived there, no one wanted to rent an apartment or a house to a Jewish family. Therefore, we stayed with my aunt and uncle. And it was not easy because they had three children and us two, my sister and I, five children in the bedroom was bedlam.

(Announcement)

Don't worry about that.

Okay. After about, um, oh, a, a half a year or so, my father was lucky enough to find an apartment. Um, it was in the, it was a big apartment house. I remember the first floor was taken over by a bank and we were upstairs on the second floor. We had a very small apartment. It consisted only of a living room, one bedroom and a kitchen, and the bathroom was out in the hallway and we shared it with another family. And, but we were very happy with it. At least we had a place of our own. What I missed the most was I didn't have a yard to play in. My parents did allow me to play in front of our apartment house, but I had to stay there, not go anywhere else. And so, I followed their directions, and I made some friends.

As a matter of fact, one of the girls, she's my age now, we are still in touch, once in a while. But she lives in New Jersey, so I don't see her very often. And one day, as we were playing in the street on the pavement, suddenly, I noticed two Nazis approaching us. And I looked at them and an emotion came over me that I had never experienced before, and that emotion was hatred. I realized I hated them. And as they passed by, I go to the gutter, I pick up some pebbles, and I threw the pebbles at their back, not really meaning to hit them, but they did. They turned around and started going after us, and it was just lucky that we knew the alleyways of Karlsruhe better than they did, and we managed to escape. When I came back, come back from downstairs, I open the door to our apartment and my mother looks at me and she says in German, Du bist dumm — which means, you are stupid. She was very angry with me. She says I could have really gotten hurt. So, I promise I would never do such a thing again.

Then came Crystal Night, and that was a terrible night because the Nazis were burning all the synagogues across Germany. And after that, my parents realized they didn't want to stay in Germany anymore, except my father had doubts. He, he kept saying, well I don't know any other language. I’ve never been outside of Germany, it's all I’ve known, but my uncle, who was a young man, he said, come you know what we should do? We should go to Israel. Well, my father would not go. He wanted us to stay even though my uncle and my grandma left. I missed my grandma very much, also my uncle. He had been a lot of fun. He was a young man and he played with me. So, we stayed on, but things got worse and worse because first of all, I forgot to tell you, after Kristallnacht, my father had, um, seen our synagogue burning and he left to see if he could find any religious articles to save. Well, we waited for him to come home that night. I still remember my mother waiting, pacing the bedroom floor back and forth, back and forth. Why isn't he coming home? Well, he never did come home. We were very upset and yet, we still had hope. We had hoped that our father would come back so we would stand by this door sometimes, look out at the window and kind of take turns that way, but he never came back, not then. My mother managed as best as she could, but it was difficult.

Then one day, there was a knock on our door. And I opened the door and there stood this man, all covered with blood and mud. I didn't recognize him right away. We had a black wood-burning stove right across the door and as he came through the door, he went to touch the stove and as he, as he put his hands on the stove, I realized it was our father. And I screamed, papa, papa it's hot. So, my cries made my mother come into the kitchen. She took one look at him and took him into the bedroom. My father was a sick man for quite some time, but after a while, and I didn't know how long it took, he was better. And he would come home, he would be gone all day, in the evenings he would come home, and he would complain that his hands were hurting him. So, one day, I said to him, papa what do you do? And he says, I’ve become a brick layer. So, I, you know, I thought okay, he's a brick layer. And it didn't bother me too much, I guess. But I was wondering and one day I said to him, how come you're a brick layer? That is not your profession. And he says, that is for, what I have to do now.

Yes, life was tough, and it got tougher. And suddenly, my father was gone. He never came home and we're wondering, why? Where is he? We couldn't understand it. But I guess the Nazis had rounded up all the Jews they could find and taken them to concentration camps, and so we knew that's where our father was. How long he was gone, I have no idea, but one day the door opens up and there stood this man all covered with blood and mud. And we were absolutely shocked. And thank goodness my fa, my mother, she had, um, she had specialized in nursing, so she was able to get my father well again because by then, also Jews were not allowed to, um, employ doctors unless they were Jewish, and they didn't know it. But my father then recovered.

The next thing that I remember is a loud knock on our kitchen door. My mother opens up the door and there stood two Gestapo. My mother was shaking. I knew she was afraid and, but she says to him, to them I should say, uh, what do you want? And they said, just go pack. And she says, why? Where are you taking us? And they saw, they said, uh, to her in a loud voice, don't ask so many questions. Just go and pack enough for two weeks. So, my mother went to the bedroom to pack. And I had a doll that I loved very, very much and I always had her. And so, I went to the living room to pick up my doll. I wanted to take her with me. The Nazi had followed me one of them, and he sees me picking up the doll and he takes my arm and starts shaking me and saying, where you're going you don't need this doll. And I looked at him and I thought to myself, he wants that doll. But out loud I said, if I can't have that doll, you can't have her either. And so, I took my doll that I loved so much, and I threw her on the floor. I didn't want that Nazi to have it. The doll broke into many pieces. I was very, very upset.

And after a little while, I noticed my mother in the kitchen and I go and join her, and I was upset and so I go and get a hold of the kitchen table leg, and I wouldn't let go as they were trying to take us out of our apartment. I gave my mother a terrible time. I scream I yell all kinds of what shall I say, well they were cuss words at the Nazis, and it was a terrible time.

They took us to the railroad station. After a while, well there were a lot of people in the railroad station. The whole station was still filled with people, many of them had been there for some time because they were laying on their coats. People tried to sit down somewhere. It was, it was, it was quite a sight. Now, this was 1940. After a long while, the train came, and it was a regular train [?]. Many of us were put onto the train. It was very crowded. And then, the train started, and it went slow, even slower as we turned, um, you know like corners and some people were sitting in the hallway because they didn't have any place to sit. After a long while, it seemed like a long while but actually it wasn’t, we arrived at our destination. We were in France and then we had to change trains.

And on our way to the southern part of France, the Nazis searched us. If they found any gold or anything worthwhile, they would take it from you. I still remember my mother had, um, she wore golden hoop earrings and one of the Nazis tore the earrings right off her earlobes. To this day, I can hear her cry with the pain. And the train kept going all the time until he, they reached the southern part of France. We got off the train and suddenly, the men and the women were separated. And I didn't want my father to leave. I made a big, big fuss, but I had no choice. My father left. My mother explained to me that actually he wasn't very far away, that we were only divided by, um, barbed wire and that I would see him sometimes, so I calmed down.

Then they took us to a large barrack and there, searched again. When we were done with that, they, uh, told us in which barrack we were. They took us to a concentration camp by the name of Gurs. We went to the barrack and sure enough, it wasn't much of a place. There were quite a few people in the barrack. I think there must have been around 50, give or take, I’m not sure. There was just, it was just, one man after the other, that's all. And so, we tried to make ourselves comfortable but it was very hard for my mother I’m sure to sleep because she had two little kids with her in her bed so that wasn't very comfortable. The food was scarce. We didn't have much to eat.

During the day, the grown-ups would go to work. And as children, we had to be sharply at nine o'clock at a certain place and there, they would have roll call for us. When that was done, they took us on long walks until about lunchtime so then we had lunch. In the afternoon, we would go to the big barrack where we had to come to and there, there was a lady. And she would yodel and sing for us so I thought, well since she yodels, she must be from Switzerland. And one day, I went after her and I said, uh, you see how we live here, why don't you do something about it? And she looked at me and she says, things are going to get better. Things are going to get better. So, I waited for things to get better, but they never did.

One day, I got it into my head that I want to visit our father and see how he is. So, I took my sister's hand, and we went to the entrance of the camp. Right away, the Nazi comes to, comes out and speaks to us saying, where do you think you're going? And I said to him, we just want to go and visit our father and we'll come back. He must have argued with me because the one thing that I also remember is I got real angry at him and I kicked him on his foot and I said in French, sale cochon, which means, you dirty pig. And I took my sister's hand and I said to her, let's go and we went outside of the camp. And I said to her, whatever you do Susie, do not look back or he might shoot us.

So we went to the camp where the men worked and somebody showed us in which barrack our father was. Well, he could hardly believe it that we had come to see him. We were crying because we were so happy to be with each other. It was a wonderful feeling, and we had a good visit, but something happened during that visit. They were handing, the Nazis were handing out to everyone, raw eggs in the shell and I could hardly believe it because I had not seen an egg since we left Germany. So, I could hardly wait to share the egg with my sister and my father. As he got the egg, he opened it up very carefully because it was raw and suddenly, he becomes agitated, and I wonder why. And I go and look into the egg and lo and behold, there was blood in it. Well, we come from an orthodox Jewish family, very religious, and that man, my father could not eat the egg with the blood in it, but I thought, oh he'll make an exception. After all, we're starving. To my surprise, my father, he was furious. He took the egg and threw it against the wall of the barrack. And that was that. But to this day, I have nothing but admiration for my father because he believed in his way of life and under the most horrible circumstance, he still tried to do what was right for him. It's something I’ve never forgotten. When I’m tempted to do something that isn't quite so good or wrong, I think of my father, and it keeps me from doing what is wrong.

We got back to the women's camp and suddenly, we were transferred to another camp by the name of Rivesaltes and then it was more or less the same thing, but I got sick, and my mother had to take me to an infirmary. It was a small room, one window. And one day, I noticed my father standing outside of that window and I could hardly believe it. I was so happy to see him, but I asked him, how come they let you come and see me? And he says, it's because I’m being transferred to another camp. Well, that didn't make me very happy. We had a good visit, but I never, never realized that that was the last time that I saw my father.

I, I was better. After a while, my mother came for me and she said, you know, you cannot last much longer here. It's time for you to leave me. I made a big fuss. I want to stay with her. I didn't care. I want to be with my mother. But nevertheless, one day, it was a big truck and I had to say goodbye to her. It was the hardest thing that I had done up to that point in my life. I cried [?], and I just could only, I can only imagine how hard it must have been for her.

The truck rolls out of the camp, and then they drove us to the southern central part of France and there, we were living in a chateau. The people who saved us were French Jewish people. It was an organization called the OSE, French organization, and they tried to take, excuse me, as many children out of those camps as possible and they established children homes in the central southern part of France. They were big homes, chateaus, and it was, life again was different. It was much better naturally, we had better food, we had better care, we slept just one person in the bed, and it was nice being there, but the Nazis were after us.

So, excuse me, and so we were really never safe, and we never stayed in one place very long. I never knew what it was like to make friends, friends for instance because we didn't have enough time where we were to make friends really. So, um, we had, we didn't have much of a social life, but this was better than being in a concentration camp and the people were very, very nice to us. We stayed, excuse me, and we stayed, um, with the, with this organization until 1943.

1943, Hitler was in a bigger hurry than ever to kill all the Jews. We were not safe with this organization anymore and they hid us children wherever possible. My sister and I, we were hidden in a convent in France, Millau. Millau was a small-town, northern part of France. So, life again was different. I didn't know anything about, uh, Catholics but I learned because we had to go to church, and we started the catechism and I liked it there. It was okay. At least we weren't running from the Nazis anymore and because of that, one day, I talked to one of the sisters. She was a young sister and I liked her, and we had become friends. I said to her, you know it would be much easier for me just to turn Catholic and be safe. I’ll just stay with you.

She looked at me for a moment and then she said, you know if you turn Catholic, you would be giving up your religion. You would be giving up everything that you have ever known and everything that your father taught you. So, I told her, well I’ll think about it. And thought about it and I realized that it was the wrong thing for me to do. I remembered my father and he, I also remembered all the things that he had taught us, and I couldn't do it. We stayed at the convent for, it was about a year, the war was almost over with and that was wonderful. And now, we had to choose where we wanted to go.

My grandma, she wrote to us and I was so happy to hear from her and I said okay, I will go to Israel because that's where she was, but they discouraged me from that. They said it's too long a journey. You couldn't fly right away at that time, so you had to go by boat, and it would have been a very hard journey. My aunt and uncle in England also wrote to us and they wanted us, so they decided that England would be the shortest route and it would be better for us to go there. So we came to England. And it was wonderful. We had enough food to eat. We lived in a very nice home and, um, my aunt and uncle, they had a little boy and I helped them take care of him. And also, I started going to school. I had only one year of school in Germany so going to school now was a little hard and I lasted for about six weeks and then I decided no, I’m not going, I don't want to go to school anymore.

And I got myself a job and what it was, it was, I I knew quite a bit about, um, sewing and also, I, I learned how to make [?], and I don't know what else. I think I also knew how to make buttonholes. We used to do them by hand at that time and I got a job and I worked. I was 13 by then. We stayed in England for three years and it was, I liked it very much but then a letter was found that my father had written to my aunts in New York and in the letter, it says if anything happened to my mother or father, you should come to New York City and stay with my two aunts and uncle. Those aunts were sisters of my mother. So, we, uh, my aunt told me, my aunt in England told me, we had to leave. And I really didn't want to leave. I want to stay. I like everything about living there and I had a very dear girlfriend that I still have to this day, But I had to leave so my sister and I, we left in 1947, uh, was it 1947 or was it more like 1945? We left for England. And, um, oh well I got mixed up. Yeah, we've been in England for two years, yeah until 1947 and then we came to the United States.

And it was absolutely overwhelming for us because everything was so big and there was so much of everything. Um, going to grocery store was a big deal to me, for instance. There was so much to choose from, but we got used to it. And I had to start going to school because that was the law. Well, I went to the high school nearest us and I told my aunt, you know I don't know how you expect me to go to school after having only had one year of schooling. And she says, well let's see what the principal says. So, um, we went up there to the school and he gave me a test. What kind it was, I really don't know but lo and behold I passed it, so I started high school. And I had a very nice teenage life. And after graduating high school, I got married. I have four lovely daughters and eight grandchildren and great grandchildren, but I was, and my sister too, we were lucky, so lucky because six million Jews died because of Hitler.

It was a terrible, terrible time. And also, when I think about it, it was easy for Hitler to do what he wanted to do, to get rid of all the Jews because the German people were born up, born up hating Jews. So, Hitler had a very easy time. Prejudice is a terrible thing, also hatred. We should try and have respect for everyone. Also, if your views are different than someone else's, it's okay. We don't all have to think alike. We can be different. It makes things so much more interesting when you think about it. Yes, I was very lucky and that's why I speak out because I want, I want all of this to be remembered because it's a lesson. And I hope you will remember it. Thank you very much. If you have any questions, I’ll be happy to answer them.

Thank you so much for your time, I appreciate it. We really are grateful for your time and appreciate you sharing your story with us. That really means a lot to us. Uh, we'll see if the kids have any questions. Anybody help with some question? You can talk to your shoulder partner [?]. Alright, you wanna sit there and I'll repeat it or do you just wanna come up here? Ok.

What was your favorite, uh, time before the war?

Ok. Um, the students asked, was there a time before the war you can remember, uh, do you have any great memories from before this happened that you could share with us?

Yes, I can. For instance, the Jewish holidays, that was a big thing for us. It's mostly you know family things that we did that I remember. Um, yeah in Germany, like I said, things were, um, hard to live there because I, because of the prejudice they had against Jews, even my, the one year that I went to school, I had a very difficult time because I realized, because the kids used to yell at me, uh, dirty Jew, Christ killer and whatnot. And, um, and so that made it very hard. It made me realize that I was different just because I was Jewish, and I didn't understand that. And my mother really didn't explain it very, very well because I would ask, I would say, why do they, why do they hate me? What's the matter? And she says, well they're the others. That's all she would say. So, um, it was difficult but it's something I’ve never, never forgotten, and I taught my kids, don't you ever be prejudiced against anyone. Accept people for what they are and respect them. It's important.

Awesome, thank you very much. Let's see if we got another one. Uh, the question is, what brought you to Omaha, Nebraska?

That's a long story. I’ve been here a long time. Um, my husband, it was my husband, um, he always liked the Midwest, and he had an opportunity to work for my father-in-law who owned some grocery stores, and so my husband would go and manage those stores for him. And and we lived in O'Neill for about eight years, and it was very, very nice. We were the only Jewish people but let me tell you, everybody was, they were all wonderful to us. When there was a social, um, some you know, social what you might say, something going on for the town or like we belong to the masons, they always made sure that they didn't give us any pork, that they'd have something else for us. So that means they had respect for us and that was nice, but everybody was great.

Thank you very much. Was there a time where you felt very discouraged, and you started to lose hope that things just weren't going to get better?

You know, I never felt that way. I always had hope. I often, when I look back on it, I think hope is what kept me going. It's important to have hope.

Where did you find that hope? What did you hold on to?

Um, well um, I don't know. I just, as a matter of fact, it happened while I was, um, earlier when I was at the convent, when things were so much, you know, different for me and, um, and I did have problems with not, you know, not having a, uh, what should I say, a Jewish way of life, that I had a different way of life. But I told my, I, I don't know for some reason, I always felt things are going to get better. Things are going to get better. And I always said a prayer that you say morning and also nighttime and I think that helped too.

Awesome, thank you. Um, and we had another question, uh, how, how did your sister, uh, end up? Does she stay with you in the convent and then?

She was with me until, uh, she got married.

Okay.

And then, uh, her and her husband move to Israel, yeah in 1990. Yeah.

Alright. Anybody else have any questions? I’m sorry. Uh, what was your reaction to your, uh, your first impression to the concentration camp, uh, for the first time?

The first time, I don't know. I looked at it and, uh, I thought, oh what a horrible place and what are we gonna do all day. Um, but, uh, what was worse, not so much the looks but also, we didn't have enough to eat and that was hard. And I know my mother got thinner and thinner. She probably gave us some of her food.

Okay well, we just really want to say thank you from the bottom of our hearts for making time for us today and sharing your story and being vulnerable with us. It really means a lot. We're excited to take what we've learned from you and our time at the Holocaust museum and, and make sure that this stuff never ever, ever happens again. And we make sure to treat others with love and respect to the best of our ability. So, thank you again.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Alright. Thank you so much, Walnut Middle School. Have a good trip. When do you go to Washington D.C.?

We leave next Friday.

Oh, you're going soon.

I know.

Well, that will be great. I think it is going to be a really, a good experience for you guys and I just wanted to let you know that you will be the last generation who will get to hear firsthand testimony from a Holocaust survivor. Your children will not have that privilege, so I hope you remember this. I hope this is something that someday you can tell your kids or your nieces or your nephews or maybe your students if you become teachers because we need good teachers, teachers who understand about empathy and compassion and treating people with respect. So have a great trip and thank you for being so attentive and quiet with great questions. Thank you.

Thank you. Bye.

Bye.

You guys did a great job. Push in your chairs.